In an email conversation with a respected fellow automotive journalist last evening, I was accused of being a “secret GoldWing fan” or something to that effect. Needless to say, I violently resented the implication… that my admiration of the ‘Wing was in any way secret. I could easily see myself owning a GoldWing. Maybe not right now, but certainly before I die. I have none of the contempt for the cross-continental set that seems to be part and parcel of sportbike or cafe-racer ownership. It’s not yet the right choice for me, but that isn’t to say that I would be unhappy to ride one over long distances.
The truth is that the GoldWing is one of those brilliant products that both defines a market segment and then comes to utterly dominate it. But that doesn’t mean that the big Honda won the battle of the Yamato-class cruiser by default. Each of the Japanese “Big Four” fielded a Wing-alike in the Eighties. And the (relatively short) story of how and why each of the competitive products failed is worth a bit of examination, if only because the same thing happens everywhere from watches to handguns.
The original GoldWing doesn’t look much like a GoldWing at all, does it? The original concept for the bike was that it would further the revolutionary work done by the original 1969 CB750. That bike was a chain-drive, air-cooled, inline four with two valves per cylinder operated by a single overhead cam. The GoldWing was a shaft-drive, water-cooled, boxer four with two valves per cylinder operated by a single cam in each head. The best way to think of it was as a BMW R-bike killer, since it had more power in a more compact package.
This is more like it, right? It’s the 1981 GL1100 Interstate, the first “factory full dresser” and the template from which all future imitators would spring. Of course, people had been putting fairings on GoldWings (and everything else) for a decade or more, but this was the first bike that offered everything nicely integrated straight from the Marysville plant. It was such a brilliant idea that all three of Honda’s Japanese competitors followed suit in short order. Oddly enough, the NonWings copied the style but not the fundamentals of the Interstate.
Yamaha struck first, with the Venture Royale. It was powered by a V-4 that would also make an appearance in the first-generation V-Max.
Kawasaki was next, using the inline-six from their Z1300 to make the Voyager 1300. It had fuel injection, which Honda wouldn’t put on the Wing as a standard feature until 2001. (There were fuel-injected special-edition four-cylinder Wings.)
The final entry, in 1984, was the Suzuki Cavalcade. It was the biggest of the original Japanese tourers, had the largest engine, and boasted the most power. It was like the Hayabusa of GoldWings, you could say.
Kawasaki thought better of the six-cylinder Voyager and introduced an inline-four “Voyager XII” in 1986. It had four valves per cylinder and was the quickest tourer on the market when it was released.
What’s interesting here is the sheer number of approaches tried:
- boxer four (Honda)
- V-4 (Yamaha, Suzuki)
- inline four (Kawasaki)
- inline six (Kawasaki)
At this point, it was anybody’s game. The GoldWing had a sterling reputation, but the other bikes were also reliable and comfortable. Things could have continued like this indefinitely.
Except it didn’t, because just as the other three Japanese manufacturers were getting the kinks worked out of their first-generation full-dressers Honda decided to set the bar too high for anyone else to reach. The GL1500 was outrageously massive — so much so that it had a reverse gear that was powered by the starter — yet it was easy to ride. It made the Venture, the Voyager, and the Cavalcade instantly obsolete. Suzuki gave up almost immediately, pulling the Cavalcade from the market in 1988. Yamaha hung on until 1993, while Kawasaki continued to build the Voyager XII in the United States until after the millennium. They actually sold a few in 2003!
The introduction of the GL1800 in 2001 was the final nail in the competition’s coffin. While Kawasaki, Yamaha, and Suzuki all field big-bore touring bikes today, they are styled and engineered to compete with the V-Twin Harley-Davidson Electra-Glide, not with the flat-six Honda. That’s because Harley is now the market leader for touring bikes. The “modern tourer” market really consists of just Honda and BMW now.
What I would suggest is that Honda “won” the Japanese tourer battle by being proactive, not reactive. They looked ahead and they didn’t worry about what the competition was doing. But having won that battle, they stopped worrying about the segment, which allowed Harley, Indian, et al to come back and take a big slice of the pie. The current GoldWing platform is fifteen years old and there seems to be no plan to replace it.
Perhaps it’s part of the ennui that seemed to seize Honda about ten years ago. The 2008 Accord was a disappointment and the 2012 Civic was just plain subpar. The current Odyssey doesn’t have the virtues of its predecessor. Yet the company took action to revitalize the Accord and Civic in short order. Maybe they’ll do the same with the GoldWing. But what could Honda do to improve over the current bike? What would be a technological leap that would get people interested in trading their old Wings in for new? My suggestion: a proper hybrid. Drop the engine size back to one liter and four cylinders. Make up the power gap with a synergy drive. Mileage would increase, and with it range, which really matters to the ‘Wing crowd. It would be impossible to stall the bike if it used the electric motor from rest. Give it an all-TFT instrument panel and a new generation of radical looks.
There is a whole generation of “socially conscious” Gen-Xers out there who are going to turn fifty pretty soon. They’ve been driving Hondas and Toyotas their whole lives. Now’s the chance to get them behind the bars of a hybrid GoldWing for their retirement years. I might not buy such a bike, but I’d sure like to see them on the roads. And I’d like to see the imitations, too. Can you imagine a quick-bake Suzuki hybrid tourer, eight hundred pounds of battery and plastic? Why not?
Ever spent any time on a Bimmer? Had a r1200rs & a k75s before the kids came along. Fantastic rides for hours and hours.
K75 is one of my favorite motorcycles of all time, so smooth and balanced. I’d love to pick one up, or an R1200R.
My Dad had an ’83 Venture Royale from about ’88-’95. Parents had the intercom system between the helmets and took it on many rides all over WV and VA. Very dependable bike, never had a single issue with it. I brilliantly decided to take it out for an unadvised and unauthorized spin one fine sunny day. Well, I was used to air cooled bikes that warmed up quickly. Turns out water cooled bikes take longer. I took off and noticed it stumbled a little bit, but took off regardless. Got to the main intersection in town, with crossing traffic. I stopped, made sure nothing was coming, went to turn left, and stalled it right in the middle of the turn. This surprised me and I laid it down very softly right in the middle of the intersection. These bikes are NOT light. Somehow, my scrawny 17 year old, 150 pound ass lifted that bike up, got it restarted, and took it straight home. The fact that there was a semi heading my way may have given me a slight adrenaline boost. Not a scratch, Dad was never the wiser. Needless to say I never rode it again.
It’s a nice bike but just a damned shame the tire technology hasn’t kept up. If only someone would try something different, like, just spitballing here, maybe a car tire to handle the weight?
Oh right, I think you might have already covered that.
My dad had a early 70’s CB750 outfitted with a Windjammer fairing, chrome luggage rack and the works. Pre-Goldwing. Hell of a beast for the day. I can certainly see something like that closer to retirement if the current cruiser fad doesn’t abolish the modern tourer category completely.
My opinion over the years was; If you wanna ride a couch, stay home. I had a Wixom fairing on a 1974 R75/5 I bought and it gave some horrendous “head shake” around semi’s and in cross winds. I took it off and rode “naked” bikes for almost the next 30 years. Then I had a chance to get a K100RT, 1985 Euro spec, for a great price. Original plan was to tinker it a bit and flip it. After the first ride, I was shocked at the technology in that 20 pounds of frame mounted fairing. I never ended up selling it as it was a fine long distance high speed machine (when you absolutely, positively, have to be there overnight). I have since added a H-D bagger and still have a couple “naked” bikes for around town fun.Will I get a Wing someday? Possibly when I get old (only 58 now).
The original engine design for the wing was actually a 1500 6 cylinder, but before it was released, it was decided it was too much motor for the world back in the ’70’s, so it was scaled back to the 4 cyl 1000 cc unit.
My how times have changed - you can buy a 2300 cc Triumph these days!
“Had a r1200rs & a k75s” ~ those are _Beemers_ ~ Bimmers have four wheels .
‘Wings are nice bit I’m not interested yet in a Road Sofa (TM) , hopefully never .
I have friends who ride ‘Wings and I’m always amazed at how well they handle the twisty bits at speed , two up when in the hands of a competent Rider .
When Honda released the 6 cylinder naked , I had to avert my eyes , I was worried I’d have to go buy one if I so much as touched one…
-Nate
hah you are correct sir! also, it was an 1150rs not a 1200…recovering from surgery, i’m blaming it all on residuals from that!
Wasn’t the Gold Wing the first thing that Honda assembled in Marysville, the basis for all that followed there?
It was indeed.
I hope you get better fast ~ I hate dope and only take my pain meds when forced to by lack of sleep .
FWIW , there are plenty of good low mileage R1200RTP’s out there for sale , many more that are battered / crashed and cheaper yet .
Me , I’m an AirHead guy and love riding my Boxer Twins .
Too bad I can’t add a photo .
-Nate
Now I’m waiting for the handgun article. From Colt 1911 to Beretta M9 to Glock 17/19.
? Why not start with the Colt 1932 Pocket .32 ? .
-Nate
Oops , wrong year , not 1932 , 1903 .
-Nate
Anything that weighs 800 pounds should have at least three wheels, if not four.
If you can fit a rider, a passenger and a backpack with a tent for two, cooking gear, enough food for several days, and a couple of changes of clothers on top of a 400-500 pound bike with a 750cc road bike, why do you need to be able to pack your entire seasonal wardrobe into some saddlebags just to go on a multiday motorcycle trip?
Norton Commando. Triumph Bonneville. BSA Lightning Rocket. A BMW if you like. Maybe even a Sportster.
But if I’m ready to sit on a sofa, I won’t be needing the wheels anymore. YMMV, and just my opinion, but “bikes” like the GoldWing are just a whole lot of overkill.
If the Brit style bikes aren’t fast enough, get a sport bike. But if you want to go touring, it doesn’t mean you need to ride on the two wheel equivalent of a camper-van.
Is that a picture of some fancy “high speed” peg to the asphalt cornering, or is that an incipient sow’s nose heading into the trough kind of a picture at the top.
Looks like it could be either…cornering to the peg, or a split second before a crash and burn landing.
I think it’s from a “rodeo” of sorts.
Volando ;
Do you still ride ? .
This pic of a ‘Wing is nothing special ~ you have to see how the die hards put them through their paces to believe it .
‘ Wingers ‘ have multiple Rodeos all across America .
I think they’re an odd bunch but then I like to ride my 1970 Honda CT90K2 to Death Valley and back so I’m not throwing any stones at Wingers .
Me , I don’t want a Road Sofa (TM) but I kinda - sorta understand those who do .
I can’t post pix here , Jack has a pic of me on my current favorite daily rider if he cares to post it .
-Nate
Looks damn good to me!
Nate-
When our son was born 21 years ago, I didn’t have a bike, and my wife made me swear that I wouldn’t ride one while he was under 21, because she thought they were a sure ticket to injury or death.
Now that he has turned 21, he and I have begun working on the idea that a father-son long distance motorcycle trip, while I am still young enough and coordinated enough to do it, would be a good bonding experience…her choice if she wants to ride on a back seat or stay home.
Not sure how that will work out, but I would like to have a decent Bonnie or Norton, with my son picking out whatever appeals to him (and isn’t a $20K+ ride, I hope).
The only experience I ever had of people putting large hog-like bikes through their paces was when my father was alive and in the Shriners. He was in the Oriental Band, but at their parades I would see what I thought were old geezers at the time (before I became one), doing similar stuff with ‘Gliders.
So it seemed to me like that pic might have been just a decent trick maneuver, depending on the rider’s skill, or it could have been a pic of the moment before disaster. Wasn’t sure which.
Is that you on that red bike in the pic Jack posted? I figure it has to be, since you asked Jack to post a pic. Plus I remember your comment about your cane carrying sling. Nice machine…what is it?
I could see getting something like that also. Seems like a decent size…big enough but not a huge pile of iron.
A Father / Son Moto trip sounds like much fun .
My Son and I rode tandem for many years , he’s developed into a very fast and competent rider who races competitively , I stopped trying to keep up with him 20 years ago .
That Moto is my 2010 Ural Solo sT , a custom built Solo by Ural , a Russian Manufacturer who makes sidecar rigs more or less based on old BMW’s .
As you said , compact and sturdy , they’re *very* fun to ride and reliable as anvils and almost as simple to maintain and repair .
Cheap , too .
The cane rig SUCKS as does the need to have the damn thing , I hate it but , if one rides , one must be willing to accept this possibility .
About the initial photo at a ‘ Wing Ding ‘ ~ I used to ride with the Vitctor McLaglen Motor Corps , back when my mount was a Harled Davidson Pan Head FL 1200 , we set world’s record of (IIRC) 27 men on one Moto , the Commander’s 1964 PanHead , riding it ’round a dirt baseball field in Tijuana , Mexico . I rode the headlight with one guy on my shoulders , another sitting on my helmet . interesting times to say the least .
There are some who’s ability to make a Moto , _any_ Moto dance , is simply amazing .
-Nate
If you guys go on a ride, let me know, I’d like to tag along for a few miles.
Tell your boy to watch out for that older woman. It’s one thing to be 21 and dating a 26 year old. Another thing to be 51 and dating a 56 year old.
Watch this dude. And from what I remember when it first went semi viral, he finished 3rd in the competition.
Nate,
Thanks once more for some interesting auto and moto history…saw the URAL on the tank, and knowing they are mountains in Russian, figured it was something like that. Looks like it must be a horizontally opposed twin…what is the displacement and how much HP? Does it have a broad or narrow power band?
If you ever decide to part with it, please let me have a shot at it. About how much do they go for, and where can you find them? I had never even heard of a Ural til I saw yours.
I remember the Victory McLaglen moto thing now that you mention it, though it was buried in the back of my mind for decades. I also remember seeing photos of that pyramid.
Another weird ability to put motos through their paces in unusual ways was a guy whose troupe is part of my childhood memories: Joey Chitwood and his Globe of Death, which was a steel sphere made of bars a couple of inches wide and about four to six inches apart, as I recall. The diameter was probably around fifteen to twenty feet. Joey would crank up a bike, a smallish two banger, inside the globe, as would a couple of other riders. Then they would proceed to circle the inside of the globe, one horizontally, and two vertically, with the vert axes at a right angle to each other. Three guys tearing around the globe in three different directions, and never colliding. As I recall, they would even switch routes, while running at speed.
Later, when I came home from college for a year, to do my USMC initial drill/training obligation, I lived in half of a duplex of apartments behind a nice house on the waterfront near the winter quarters for the carnies and circus people…the West Coast of FL. And it turned out that the daughter of the owner, and her girlfriend, two hot but totally wild young “ladies” who were then about nineteen, had run off with one of the Globe of Death riders, and the friend had been his carnival “wife” for a season or two.
Because the scene reminded me too much of Bob Dylan’s 115th Dream, I never got that close to either of them. But I heard some hairy tales, to say the least, even compared to the ones I heard going to HS with several circus family kids.
Seems that the globe riders had an informal club called the Motordrome Muff Divers & 69ers club…I think I can get away with saying that, since it is a fact and not fiction I concocted…complete with membership cards, etc., and “carney wedding licenses”, which the one girl showed me to convince me that they weren’t just making the whole thing up.
While I realize that the globe riding is mostly a matter of timing, it still must take a fairly good amount of skill and a pair of brass ones.
In case you haven’t even seen the Globe act, there was a depiction of it in the Ryan Gosling film In the Pines or Beyond the Pines, or whatever Pines movie he made a couple of years ago. The movie setup looked like the real deal I saw as a kid.
But as to the father son trip, I hope I can find a couple of solid midsize road bikes, and so much the better if they are unusual, cheap-ish, and sturdy. I fantasize about getting my son to ride with me to my best friend’s winter home in Pescadero, at the bottom of the Baja California peninsula near San Jose del Cabo. Ideally, we might drive cross country in my Panther, leave it in SoCal, and ride a pair of bikes down and back. A single bike with a sidecar is a possibility though I don’t think that that would be as much fun, nor would we have built in redundancy.
All of that is contingent on him not suddenly settling down to help his new GF raise her two kids…she might be the one he is destined to hang on to, but I figure the odds are in my favor, as this is the first time he has been to that rodeo.
As to the cane, it sucks that you have the injuries to require it, but it is a fairly utilitarian rig, and it might come in handy in the event of a sudden close encounter with young whippersnapper road rage. Hope you never have to use it thusways, but if you do, it will be a good approximation of a samurai behind the back sword carry, used when they wanted it out of the way so as not to catch on things in passing.
Jack, I have told him that, several times. And although we have a good rapport and he respects my experience and judgment, he is convinced he knows what he is doing.
26, divorced, two kids is not what I would have hoped for him. But she did get out of an abusive marriage instead of sticking around, she is a good mother to the kids, has a great job, especially for her age ($28/hr in NC), and apparently neither she or my son is into hardcore partying, and both try to have a good relationship with God, as they understand him, so they do have a few things going for them.
All I can do is tell him what I think the odds are, and reassure him that if it doesn’t work, he can just come back, that he hasn’t burned his bridges by striking out on his own in this direction.
And perhaps it is selfish of me, but the thing I am most upset about is that he will be an eight hour drive away from me, for the first time ever. And with my wife wanting to go back to school here or in DE, I will literally be between a rock and a hard place on this.
Most of us who have run with the dogs at some point in our lives know that it is easy to believe that you have found THE one several times over a couple of decades. He is convinced that since they both have such strong positive feelings for each other that this MUST be THE one. I hope he is right, but I fear more that he is wrong.
But even if I could get him to abandon his plan with some kind of control trip threat, it would only make him more rebellious and angry down the line, and poison what we have.
So I am trying to be patient and wait and see…wish I could know up front how it will end, but I do believe he will have to find out for himself this time.
He does promise to wait at least several months before deciding to marry, and at least a couple of years before they start a family, so I can only hope that either he has found his soulmate or that the chinks and cracks will surface before the die is cast irrevocably.
And I can’t honestly tell him I would never do anything like that, since I did almost EXACTLY like that when I was in my early twenties…a 31 y/o grad school potter, the ex-wife of a faculty member, two small kids, a toddler boy and a Kindergarten girl, plus a tendency to pills and wine…and she had a scar across one entire cheek from a car accident when she was small, thrown into and through a windshield. A classic tall, soft-spoken, thin, athletic, slightly freckled Swedish beauty with a smile that could have been the cause of global warming.
And though I was no angel, her flirtation with getting into the bottles deeper and deeper ultimately killed our relationship.
It probably pained my parents greatly, though at that time all I thought about was what I wanted. And I was wrong, dead wrong, though I enjoyed a couple of good years before we hit a dead end. Ended up sort of like Kerouac’s Maggie Cassidy…tried to go home again to a home that no longer existed, or could exist.
Before that, I had already married and divorced once.
So he is much more conservative than I was, yet I still know what he does not, that chances are that it will turn out to be a heart-felt, but ultimately unsustainable, infatuation, rather than true love.
But now we (he and I) are at the point I always knew we would come to some day, with him ready to set off into the world, and me worrying if he is doing the right thing.
If I could only get him to understand the odds…but of course, in that he is just like me, only he has more respect for its effect on his old man than I did for mine.
But we have always been able to work out any difficulty that has come up between us, and we will eventually get to a point of peace for both of us on this. It is just that I am afraid that he might end up being taken advantage of emotionally, as he has a very real and genuine heart beneath his tough athletic appearance.
But for now, there is no answer except to try to help him deal with the shifts in both of their feelings that will come, as they struggle to learn to trust each other, and that only if they both really do love each other that much.
It was so much easier when he was the age of your son or Bark’s. But at least he didn’t give me endless sleepless nights during his teen years…tried partying a bit and decided that getting smashed was a dead-end, ultimately not fun proposition, so dealing with this is just that much more unexpected.
I always told myself, and my wife, that our job with him was to bring him to a point where he would be able to know what he wanted for himself, and to find that thing and live it The sad part is that for all my talk and objective belief in that statement, when it finally came, and like this, I am totally unwilling and unable to just let him go, though I have in reality no other option. But it doesn’t mean that I have to like it.k
And it might even be easier to accept, if he was being an *sshole about the whole thing towards me. Instead, he is willing to slow down, at least a little bit, and see how it goes. But he is no more stubborn than I was, and the time has come to let him make his own moves and to own their consequences. I just hope it doesn’t turn out to be a six month romance with twenty year consequences.
He does have a level head, but right now he is running on a double whammy of hormones and real feelings. He never dated just to be dating, and now that he thinks he has found the real deal, he is completely convinced that he has.
PS Jack, when and if go for a ride, we’d be honored to have you with us. Not sure what the future will bring since I’m not even certain what the present is bringing, but you would be welcome company, so we will let you know when and if…and I think it would be great fun to ride along with Nate a bit, too.
FWIW Syke over on TTAC seems like a real deal long time rider as well. Another guy I would hope to meet in real life someday.
Yeah, he says he’s been a member of a couple three-patch clubs, I think he’d be a fascinating dude to meet.
When and if I go down to NC to see my son and his new love, I will be passing through Syke’s stomping ground, which was my stomping ground in the Eighties, and I will try to look him up for a chat, “cookies and milk” or whatever…
The people on here, and some of them on TTAC, are some of the most interesting people I have run across in a long time.
I’ll post a trip report when and if…plans now are for me to take my son down to NC on the 8th for a week visit with his new love. Then down and back to bring him home for a week, a week later. Then he plans on going down at the end of the next week to stay, with travel arrangements TBD.
My limited experience with members of three-patch clubs tends to have been with guys who sat in a different pew, if not an entirely different “church”. But I have no axe to grind with any of them, so I don’t expect that should cause any issues to arise. I’d just like to get to know him a bit, and see some of his rides.
” It’s one thing to be 21 and dating a 26 year old. Another thing to be 51 and dating a 56 year old.”
Words of wisdom .
it’s also another thing to be older and date a red hot 25 year old ~ the sex was intense but she simply didn’t have enough life experience to hold my attention the rest of the time .
‘ Cougar love ‘ is terrific , BT . DT , no regrets .
Your Son will do what he’s going to do , as long as he knows :
A. you’ve never lied to him .
B. you’ll always be there when he falls
Everything , even wretched marriages with multiple Children will work out .
I know where you can buy a Ural Solo brandy new for under $6 (I *think*) , Side Car Rigs are not for the faint of heart and will _KILL_YOU_ faster that a Hyabusa so Festina lente here .
Oops ~ SMWBO says we’re heading out , more later (to - night or to - morrow) if you ask .
-Nate
Nate,
Always glad to hear what you have to say about anything and everything. I’m not antisocial, but most people haven’t done enough interesting things and don’t have enough interesting thoughts to hold my attention, but you are clearly one of the exceptions to the tendency of people to revert to the mean.
That would be to revert towards the average, for those of you not of a mathematical bent…sort of like a “save for the…” kind of thing.
A Ural for $6? Is that a typo, or are you one of Vladimir Putin’s riding buddies? BTW, what kind of bike does that guy ride? I’ve seen a couple of pictures but never one that clearly identifies it.
Yeah, things will work out for them if they are good for each other, and won’t if they aren’t. And he’s smart enough not to try to play “baby daddy” just to try to cement the relationship. And if I try to con him into bagging it, (a) he would see through it; (b) I would destroy a boatload of trust we have built together over the years; and (c) I just might be sabotaging something that might be good for him and make him truly happy.
I, too, did the Cougar patrol when younger…early twenties, a divorce already under my belt, fell in love with a 30-ish grad pottery student with a divorce, and two kids, about 2 and 6, or basically she was about five years older than my son’s new friend, and the kids were about two or three years younger. Lasted a couple of years, ended when her drinking and pill habits got on my nerves too often, but running true to form, I didn’t make any reasons to be tied down for twenty years, then or ever, until I finally met the love of my life in my early forties.
And although my best buddy made the observation that a divorced 26 y.o. woman might smack of a bit of desperation, I really don’t think so in this case. She supposedly hasn’t dated at all in the three years since the divorce was final, and has a job involving diesel engineering (not VW!) and makes $28/hr in NC, so it doesn’t seem like the classic “help me put food on my babies’ table” kind of ploys.
As long as he has enough sense not to make any babies for at least a year or two, and not to walk down the aisle for at least a year or two, it might turn out to be the real deal for him, and if not, he should be able to dust himself off and start over, if necessary. And they do seem to be talking about expectations, etc., and not just trusting love to conquer all.
So I will get the facetime app, life will go on, and either they will eventually solidify the relationship and make it permanent, or they will drift apart. One may help him along his way in life, and the other may toughen and wisen him up a bit more.
Better that he is three states away for a couple of years than that he would be with someone skanky or two-faced. He has not always followed my advice nor would I want him to be that deferential, but at least he asks me to weigh in and takes my opinions seriously.
If her age, her prior marriage and her two children are the only downsides, and if they really truly have that magical magnetism of true love, and are coupling that with enough emotional maturity to already be having serious discussions about expectations, obligations, boundaries, etc., then maybe he has a real chance at winning the romance lottery early on. And while I don’t want to push him to settle down yet, I won’t be disappointed at all if he does so with someone who is good to and for him, and she turns out to be someone that brings out the best of manhood in him.
He is past the point where I could control him, and trying to would just bring out the same stubborn defiant I-am-doing-it-my-way streak I had at his age, and still can get in touch with at the drop of a hat.
Sometimes you just have to love them and let them steer their own course. And pray for them.
I agree on all counts!
Jack & Nate-
It’s a damn shame that I am in Joisey, one of you is in OH and the other in SoCal.
Makes it difficult to take a short run over to each other’s place for a plate of barbecue or Mexican food, a short ride on two wheels, plinking some cans off of a log, or other good old boy (in the best sense of the term) pastimes every now and then.
Still, I am glad to know you as online friend.
Merry Christmas to both of you and to your loved ones as well.
Volando
Kids ~
All you can do is wind ’em up and set ’em loose .
_How_ you wind ’em up is critical IMO .
I love to brag on my Son as he’s so much smarted and better than I ever was =8-) .
Anyway , the price I wrote was indeed a typo ~ it should have read ‘ $6K ‘ , not ‘ $6 ‘ .
It was in Chi Town and the Craigslist post is down but it’s been up and down a few times so may well come back up in a bit .
Here’s another , in a suburb of Chi Town for $4,999 : http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/mcd/5348337226.html
This one is the base model , blacked out .
BTW : ‘ Cougars ‘ really get horny after they’re 40 …….
Most of the young pups I knew who tried it , couldn’t keep up with the demands .
-Nate
Or ;
If you decide to try a Combination Rig , here’s one affordably : http://www.cycletrader.com/dealers/Heindl-Engineering-2979142/listing/2013-Ural-TOURIST-116017226
The deal is this : most Sidecar rigs are impulse buys and the buyer doesn’t realize that you don’t ride a Hack Rig , you _DRIVE_IT_ ~ it’s hard work too , gives you a serious upper body workout every time .
Therefore , old guys like , er , ahem buy them and discover they don’t actually like driving them and so dump them after a few years of it just sitting with low miles , for super cheap .
Owning a side car is fun to be sure ~ kids , dogs and Women love them but it’s very different from any other Motocycle .
There’s a FREE how to ride a side car book that if you take the time to read and practice , pretty much guarantees safe driving and more fun than you can imagine .
Most Hack buyers are too proud (foolish) to bother reading the book much less practicing so they wind up somewhat like the Miata guy who recently got punted on the racetrack then want to blame anyone but them selves .
Damn guys~ I’m here on Holiday with SWMBO , her Sister and our four Foster boys , now you’ve got me wishing I had my Moto to ride in spite of the weather…..
Maybe I’ll sneak off to a local Junk Yard I don’t get to visit often , it’s good P.T. and I often find hard to find vintage bits and bobs there .
-Nate
Here you go : http://www.cycletrader.com/listing/2002-Ural-Sidecar-116678512
$3,900 with side car , it’s the vastly improved 750 C.C. model , if you discover you don’t like the chair just take it off and discard , they’re not worth much , you’ll still have a fun Moto for cheap .
-Nate
Volando, if you buy a Ural I’ll make sure to ride to Jersey this Spring to check it out.
Jack, that sounds like a tempting combo…the Ural for a cheap price and a chance to meet you in person.
I will start working on the wife right away. Or I may be able to get my son to buy it and share it while we look for something else.
I have been thinking about trying to learn a third language recently, now that I have my Spanish down to a point of equivalency with a university-educated Spanish speaker, but couldn’t decide which one I wanted to try.
But if I get the Ural, and given that Putin seems to be a better leader than the other guy whose name annoys me (I see he has refused to provide refugee aid for Christians in the middle East as he has said that they aren’t persecuted, since they could always convert to Islam and be fine)…perhaps Russian would be the ticket.
I understand Putin has managed to fix the Russian economy to the extend of tripling the average Russian salary since he came into power. Might have to move there out of economic necessity if we get Hill or Bernie in the White House.
The Ural looks like a nice clean basic workhorse machine. I think I am starting to like it. 750cc would be a nice sweet spot for the engine too.
I still like the US, it’s just the government that worries me.
I have already begun my sub rosa campaign to get SWMBO to come over to the viewpoint that her greatest fear, that a motorcycle might kill either our son or me, is actually a good reason to buy a motorcycle: so I can teach him all the things I have learned about riding.
She is impressed with the way I have been teaching him the subtleties of driving, so there is reason to believe that I may be able to bring her around by using a motorcycle purchase as a way to reduce, rather than increase, her fears.
The groundwork has been laid. I need to develop the theme carefully, so that she doesn’t get the sense that this is a plot to get a motorcycle rather than an attempt to protect our son from possible future motorcycle problems. It is too early to tell if I will be successful, or how long it will take to get her to the point of encouraging me to look for a bike, or even two.
The Ural looks like it can be a QC challenge, however.
But assuming I could get her to come around, and that I wanted to get the Ural mentioned by Nate, what would you think about checking that one out, as it is in OH (Eaton)? And if it looks workable to you, perhaps sitting on it until spring, and then possibly riding it here? We could work out details of remuneration, whether I would drive you back (and even share some time behind the wheel perhaps) in my Panther, the 97 Grand Marquis?
Right now this is just a pipe dream. But I have been successful in the past at getting SWMBO, even with her high IQ (necessary to keep me from getting bored), to reconsider things based on one or another counter-argument I have been able to come up with. So I think that there is a fair chance. The fact that the Ural has a sidecar could even be used as a way to assure her that the bike wouldn’t tip over while our son was learning, and that I could be sitting alongside him, providing him guidance as he learns. That just might be the extra “vig” I need to get her to see that this is a rare opportunity, and that we shouldn’t let it pass by, as we might not have another like it again, any time soon, especially at that price range.
Not sure how far Eaton is from you, but IIRC, OH is not that large a state anyway.
FWIW, my son is out there in Columbus with his best friend (the male one, not the new female he is convinced is the love of his life), until the 31st. They drove to Cleveland last night to see the Knicks make a credible run at the Cavs, and to see Porzingis manage to block James.
If you’re racing this weekend and would like a couple of pit crew/roadies, I could talk with them and see what they have planned. If not, no harm done..
I’ll send you an email regarding the Ural!
For anyone thinking about getting a Motocycle ;
Take the ‘ Iron Horse ‘ rider training in your area ~ it’s cheap , they provide everything you’ll need except gloves and IT REDUCES YOUR INSURANCE CO$T .
In most States it also makes it possible to get a Motocycle license endorsement without taking the riding performance part of the test .
I’ve been riding since mt Teens but when my then young Son (about 12 IIRC) decided to take up riding , I sent him to this class and was well rewarded with a Son who rides *much* better , safer and faster than I ever did .
It’ll help sell the idea to SWMBO too , no downside to this .
-Nate
BTW : no worries about transporting your new Ural home : just buy a cheap pickup truck and go get it , take your Son along , it’ll be a fun road trip .
I’ve done this many times over and someone is always ready to buy the old truck after I’ve whipped it into shape for the trip , you only need make sure it has good tires and what not , some tie downs , use th tail gate for a loading ramp .
-Nate