I’d been watching the bike from inside the restaurant, hoping I’d get out before the owner did so I could get a photo of it and put the appropriate crappy vintage filter on it. And just for once in my life, all my dreams came true. It was the cleanest and nicest V65 Sabre I’d seen in my adult life. For those of you who weren’t paying attention to this stuff, the 1983 V65 Magna was the quickest production motorcycle in history on its debut, breaking into the tens with the infamous Jay Gleason on the throttle. The 1984 V65 Sabre that followed applied square-edged modern styling to the same template.
You’ve all heard of the 1985 Yamaha V-Max but the V65 Hondas were first to the table with 120-plus V-Four power. I’d honestly forgotten about them until automotive diarist Zach Bowman started writing last month about the experience of selling his father’s V65s. Needless to say, I was excited to see a real live one in the middle of a sunny Friday afternoon.
As I was firing up my CB1100, the owner came out and got on his Sabre. I flagged him down. We chatted for a minute. He appeared to be a college heavyweight powerlifter of some type; massive shoulders, ripped arms, clipped demeanor. I’d thought he might have come into Sabre ownership by chance but a quick conversation showed that he knew exactly what he had. We parted ways and I headed back to work.
Five minutes later, I was leaning through a long sweeper on the way back downtown when I saw the Sabre in my rearview mirror. He pulled alongside my CB1100. We looked at each other, we dropped to second gear, and we cranked the throttles.
The V65’s 1098cc V-Four was a masterpiece of liquid-cooled engineering that delivered 120 horses at the crank but can still put 108 to the wheel after 80,000 miles. The CB1100 is, strictly speaking, a CB1150, with 1149cc of air-cooled inline-four tuned more for fuel economy (I average 43.9mpg on a full-throttle commute) and vintage aesthetics than for raw power. Rare is the CB11100 that can crank the 85hp mark on a dyno.
Nevertheless, for the first fifty feet I jumped well ahead — largely because of fuel injection vs. carbs, I suspect. For a moment, I was really disappointed. Would the mighty V65 fall to a retro-bike? But then the square light of the Sabre started to swell. I executed a no-lift clutchless shift to third, squeaking the rear tire with the violence of it, but before we hit the 100mph mark the Sabre was two bikes past me. I gave him the thumbs-up. He nodded slightly. He knew he was cool.
The Sabre, like the Yamaha Fazer, is a square-headlight relic of a period in motorcycle styling that seems to resonate with exactly nobody. When the CB1100 came out in 2013, the biggest criticism people had of was that Honda had dared to combine the square-tank 1985 look with 1970s detailing. A Japanese company called Samurider immediately debuted a $1500 replacement gas tank in the proper 1969 CB750 shape. They sell a ton of ’em. Nobody wants even a faint reminder of the Eighties. I wonder sometimes if that will ever change.
Good V65s are few and far between. I talked to Zach about his father’s bikes when he was selling them but he assured me that I probably didn’t the hassle. And really the CB1100 does the retro/cruiser thing for me very well. Still. There was a moment in history, my friend, where nothing on the street, on two wheels or four, could get in front of a V65 Sabre’s license plate. Think about that.
Sweet .
-Nate
Indeed.
Cager here.
What do these things weigh?
God damn powerlifting gym fags trying to bone other men
Fist bump me in the candle light.
Grab my butt and whisper “good game” to me on a beach while the sun sets.
He had massive shoulders, ripped arms; how could Jack resist?
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, and sometimes a description is just a description.
Grow up, or stick to fetishizing about mis-spelled Hoagie rolls.
What is the seat height of the cb 1100, and where do the foot controls have your feet positioned, seems as though there is no longer a standard universal Japanese motor cycle, most of the newer bikes are very niche oriented, cruisers or race bikes for the street, very few have a seating position that old short guys can tolerate for more than half an hour. Mag as and Sabers were very quick in the day, and apparently still quick. I enjoy reading Zach’s stuff almost as much as I enjoy yours Jack!
Joe,
It is an absolutely standard riding position, all but identical to my 1975 CB550 but with a slightly lower seat and lower bars. It is 100% JDM, I promise you.
Love it!
+1 for fuel injection. Lets see which bike starts and idles after it sits for a year with E10 gas.
Honda made such cool bikes in the 80s. It’s a shame that they’re losing their performance advantage in engines. The CBR500r has a 9k redline and makes less than half the power of the F4i - a 600 cc inline 4.
We hear about how durable the new engines are (but I don’t know how much better you can make an engine than a 90s Honda engine).
We hear about the fuel efficiency (which is alright in cars, but does it really matter so much in bikes?).
We hear about the low emissions (as though bikes are the reason for global warming when super tankers burn crude oil and mexican trucks get to use NAFTA to come into America and spew particulate emissions)
And now Honda’s like “oh check out our new 250RR with a redline equal to that of a 1980s Ninja 250” which is such a fall from grace compared to the O.G 250RR with its 19k+ redline.
Now every single Honda automobile engine architecture is at least 15 years old:
The L series came out in 2001
The K series came out in 2001
The J series came out in 1997 - 1 year after ODBII became standard. The J series is older than some drivers! The J series could have graduated high school last year! It’s still a fantastic engine but c’mon. This is the permissible behavior out of a corporation that calls itself “an engine company?”
It’s sad because Honda used to have a raison d’etre that saw them make excellent products for individuals who took machines too seriously and now they lost their magic, trade on their old cachet, and use the surplus value to fund an airplane/vanity project.
I think Honda’s problem is that they truly believe in all of this bullshit about AGW and reducing consumption.
I say “bullshit” not because any of it is false, necessarily, but because their excessive belief in these ideas hampers their ability to build the cars and motorcycles that people truly want.
It’s a fucking disgrace that my CB1100 makes LESS power than the last bike to carry the CB1100 name twenty-plus years ago. Yes, I’m sure it’s a better environmental citizen — but if you want to save the environment the best way to do it IMO is to make a product that is incrementally better from a consumption or emissions perspective than the competition while being more desirable and selling until the dealerships can’t catch their breath.
The late Nineties were like the final gasp for Honda. Hell, they made the Dos Equis. Can you imagine Honda’s pansy-ass, po’-faced corporate minions doing a bike to beat the ZX-14R today?
I don’t know why I’m writing this. I’m probably just the choir talking about how much the choir agrees with the preacher.
I’m 100% with you on the ‘incrementally better’ part and using the additional resources to make the product compelling because you might even pull some people into something more efficient.
Imagine if the current Fit cracked out 14 second 1/4 miles, was even more light-footed than the first gen Fit, got 40 mpg, and still cost sub-20k. I have to believe Honda might pull a few people out of CR-Vs and pulling people into the ‘right size’ car seems as efficacious as making every Fit 5% more efficient.
Though you know what would also decrease emissions on the Fit? Spinning the engine at any RPM less than 4k on the freeway. Additionally, the car might last marginally longer - and it seems like there would be fewer net emissions if we could keep cars on the road 5% longer (thereby making 5% fewer cars) than if they polluted 5% fewer emissions per mile because making cars is pretty environmentally unfavorable. And while we’re at it, nut up and offer e85 and pure gas. If car makers want to make turbo 1.5 liters with 13.5:1 static compression and only warranty the engine on E85, so be it. It’s the closest we’re ever going to come to an O.E.M trifecta tune.
Re: the CB1100. I think a fuel injected CB750k could give the 1100 a run for its money. Obviously the 1100 has O.E.M quality and it’s easily going to outlast a CB750k and require less maintenance and the CB750k was designed as a superbike and the CB1100 was not. But still, the CB1100 came out 40 years later. You’d think the penultimate should effortlessly trounce the performance of the prototype. But apparently Honda didn’t. And Honda has been playing it safe every since the Dos Equis. Their RRs are known to be the most commuter friendly supersports (which would be a cool distinction if they were also the fastest but they’re not). Their last cool bike might have been the RC51 and now their most ‘interesting’ product is an NC700x scooter / crusier with Akira bodywork.
Their recent technology experiments have ended in relative failure - VTEC VFRs suck. Their motocross bikes need oil changes every 40-80 minutes of racing or else the engine will explode. Their 250cc motorcross bike can need a valve job (which necessitates pulling the cam off to get at the shims) every 6 engines or so if a fast guy is on it.
Honda of the 90s - makes an oval piston motorcycle with 8 valves per cylinder, a bike with a 19k redline, and one of the best motocross bikes of all time: the CR250. Honda of 2010 frustrates its customers with heavy, expensive, slow bikes that “are comfortable”. Thank god they’re reliable and on the street the police equalize bikes (kinda).
So in short - I can’t imagine the folks at Honda growing the 3rd testicle required to even contest the R1 and ZX10 and Duc. I can’t imagine the folks at Honda mainlining enough Captain America serum to dream of a Honda powered cruise missile to contest the ZX-14. And even with someone as bombastic as you at the helm, the institution would break before it contested the H2(R).
Here’s an interesting bit of history sourced from a book called “The Honda Myth”:
The first few thousand CB750s were made with sand-cast parts.
Why?
Honda didn’t know if they’d sell enough CB750s to justify the expense of die-cast parts. Rightfully so, they had never sold a bike that big or fast before. But Honda was true to the experiment - they designed the bike to be as good as it could be. Why? If they sandbagged the design and the bike sucked, then they wouldn’t be able to seperate the failure of the machine from the failure of the business (they were worried dealers couldn’t / wouldn’t sell them / the bikes would be too expensive / people didn’t want fast japanese motorcycles). Now that’s pride of work - it’s doing the best job you can do regardless of whether or not you believe you’ll be rewarded for the extra effort. The rest is history - Honda sold ~445k CB750Ks during their production run (1969-1978). But that could have only happened if they took it seriously.
Nah, like I said elsewhere, I think Honda just lost interest in making anything they couldn’t sell thousands of identical copies of every year.
That’s why they make the FCX clarity and CRZ, right? Both of which are cars that sell literally in the thousands per year.
There are pictures of the old man with Aryton Senna posted in the lobby of the office building attached to the plant in marysville. The old man is rolling in his grave with the drivel that Honda currently produces. Honda hasn’t produced a revolutionary engine in quite some time and the attempt to move upmarket with Acura has been an abysmal failure once compared to Lexus. In truth, Acura is no threat to the Germans either. The BMW, Audi or MB buyer almost certainly not going to try an Acura, much less an Infiniti.
I agree with the gist of your statement, but the CBR500 and its siblings appear to have been developed for the European & Australian (maybe Asian too) beginner license market. It seems like Honda was aiming for a torquey, understressed, fuel-efficient 47 hp motor with the 500 twin because that’s where the worldwide money is. It makes 47 hp and only 47 hp because that’s all it needs to (and all it can if it is going to qualify as a beginner bike).
Buddy of mine had one when new. Not the greatest sounding bikes but damn was it fast. Best thing it just didn’t look fast. Pure UJM styling for the time and the colors (same as in the picture) made it look even more bland.
All to brief period when these were the end all-be all of motorcycle performance. And then the V-Max….with the massive rear tire (for the time mind you). I happily rode a 500 Interceptor during the era but remember the “older guys” on their Sabres and Maxs and FJ11s. Older - but fast. Very fast.
I absolutely loathe 80s cars. No nostalgia whatsoever for the Starion, 3000gt, Dodge Shelby(s), C4, Foxes and F-bodies, etc. etc. I hate them all. The same is not even remotely true for the bikes of the era. Awesome standards, the dirt bikes really came into their own, the V-4s, the first crotch-rockets AND full-dress tourers. Almost a golden age.
Jack, you didn’t do the weekly round up, so I’m going to ask here: ‘As the great Patrick Bedard used to say, however, I’m from Missouri when it comes to claims like that. In other words, you’re gonna have to show me.’ Was it you or your editor that felt the need for the explanatory sentence? Kinda kills the joke IYAM
Also, although not your responsibility or even concern, at the end of Sam Smith’s piece on the Chevy SS it has ‘From: AR Revista’ as if it was originally on their site. When you click the link it’s to some Italian lifestyle/fashion site with no mention of a Chevy SS to be found. Weird.
Regarding the former: I hated having to explain the joke, but if I didn’t, the commenters would spit blood.
Regarding the latter: apparently they hold some licensing rights for various photos.
Thanks Jack! Always appreciate the replies.
“And just for once in my life, all my dreams came true.”
You keep writing not-quite-obviously-sarcastic stuff like that and people will treat you like some rich kid with two BMW M3s.
I’ve been in your garage. I’ve seen your guitar collection. I’ve met your wife. I’ve watched your son play.
For all of us, our reach may exceed our grasp, but plenty of grown men know you’re living the dream.
Thanks for bringing back somep fond memories from the early nineties for me, Jack. My first bike was a V45 Sabre.
In ’89 I was working at the Honda factory in Alliston, ON. Hangouts on the weekend happened at Barrie, ON, which was a roughish hockey town before it became a suburb of Toronto. The main streets were packed on weekends, and one warm summer night we saw some jamoke loop his Sabre in front of a huge crowd while trying to pull a wheelie off the stoplight.
” I hated having to explain the joke, but if I didn’t, the commenters would spit blood.”
As a clueless Old Man I often am too far out of the ‘ hip loop ‘ and so appreciate having ‘ in jokes ‘ explained .
=8-) .
-Nate
Do you have a version of the photo without the filter?
I do now!
http://jackbaruth.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/2016-08-29-14.12.13.jpg
It’s so clean and unicorn-like. Need a thread on the homogenization of Honda bikes: their bikes aren’t exactly shite today but they sure aren’t very interesting.
I just gave that EXACT bike away to my best friend. He frigging loves it. Yeah, even the same color scheme as in your picture.
That bike was deceptively quick. When you first get on it, it feels heavy. But then you look at the 10k tach and that tight, watercooled V4 and give the throttle a good twist and you better be watching far, far ahead of you. I had a 750 Interceptor many year earlier, and bought a V45 Magna for the (now ex) wife, and they were fantastic bikes. And with a set of aftermarket highway pegs, a great cruiser as well.
Only the freakbikes could out run it. Many HDs tried (laughing at them). It was a 1984 bike that to this day still outruns many, many other bikes. I gave it away with 24,000 miles on it and my friend is very happy. His 850 Yamaha was too hard to find parts for. The only real weakness of the V65 (Sabres and Magnas) was that electronic spark box under the seat. But last I checked, you could still find them. And if one died (which happened to me on the Magna once), you can still limp home on two cylinders.
Geez Jack, you did the 124 Spider article and now the Sabre article. Parallel lives (you poor bastard). 🙂
Thing is — if I run a bike that’s 30+ years old and it spits out a few more hydrocarbons than a 2016 Hoosiewah bike with all the EPA shit on it, who’s being greener?
No factory spewed out anything to build a machine for me for the last 30-odd years. The amount of carbon used to produce that last new bike is easily more than 30 years worth of carbon spit out by my old motorcycle.
So I ask again, who’s being greener here? Yeah, it’s me (he says, thumbs in suspenders).